Opinions aren't behavior. But the reverse is also true. And we can expect the people who want to be our leaders (or thought leaders) to meet minimum standards for their actions.
Judge by actions, not words. Attia, Gates, Hoffman, and Summers are permanently stained. Any organization that chooses to associate with them the way they chose to associate with Epstein will suffer reputational damage.
I do hope you are right, however, many have short memories. The next boogey man may make their actions be long forgotten. I also think their money will lead the way for them to quickly return to business favor.
How many men who read this Substack have stupid locker room texts and emails in their past? Yeah, that's what I thought, every single one of us. It's what boys and men do with each other in private. We make obscene jokes that we would never dare outside of "man talk". It's not fair to judge Attia by one tidbit of an email string that I'm sure had a long precursor and tail. It's not even "terrible judgment", it's actually called privacy...distasteful privacy? Sure. Beyond that, everything is fiction.
I agree. People who happened to be in " New York Society" who were photographed at a party with Epstein are now being scorned. Any one of us who might have gone to a soiree and pictured is presumed to be a pedophile. This is insanity. I personally don't care about the hoi polloi who were there. If a man sucked up to wealth over his child, it is between him and his wife. Now his son has a history of his father being a dope forever. I am appalled by the interest in every person's dailliances. We have people being murdered in Iran, Nigeria, Sudan and not a peep from mainstream press. Our priorities are screwed up.
I don't. I have said stupid things in a locker room environment in the past, but I was never stupid enough to put them in an email or a text.
That said, I don't think the emails alone are the problem. Nor is Alex saying so. He's saying Attia's *behavior* was the problem: specifically, prioritizing meeting with a scumbag in New York over being with his wife and son when his son had a cardiac arrest. That's reprehensible *behavior*, not locker room talk.
That’s only so if the assertion regarding his sin is correct. Strikes me his wife would divorce for that. If she hasn’t perhaps the story isn’t completely accurate.
He said in his own 2017 book that he stayed in New York for ten days after learning that his son in LA had a cardiac arrest. That's already questionable, but okay, maybe he had a really, really good reason. But the Epstein emails reveal that no, his reason was to meet with Epstein. That's not a good reason at all, let alone a really, really good reason.
Note that the claim is *not* that Attia had sex with underage girls or participated in any of Epstein's schemes along those lines (which I take it is why you used the word "sin"). It's just that, as I said, he prioritized meeting with a scumbag over being with his wife and son (*infant* son) when his son had a cardiac arrest. Perhaps that's not a "sin", but it certainly seems to me like reprehensible behavior.
@Mike- I'm a woman and have said the same thing about locker room talk. As if women don't do it. Please...However, a dr responding to a patient? Uncalled for.
I completely agree if that is all the emails reveal, John and Mike. I haven’t read a good and thorough synopsis of them yet. Alex’s is the best so far, and he doesn’t really give us much detail when there are over 1700 communications. More information and context is needed. Was he Epstein’s physician? If so, as healthcare providers know, all of your patients are not Mother Theresa. We do however always have the right to dismiss a patient whose philosophy does not mesh with our own.
For his colleagues who are posting negative things about him because of this, I hope they’ve contacted him directly and had a conversation, and I commented as much on Dr. Sara Gottfried Szal’s post. Otherwise, this is cancel culture imho. I recommend people let the hot takes time period pass without a rush to judgment.
Yes, the email was crude and juvenile, and his continued association with a convicted sex offender is suspect and doesn’t say a lot of great things about his character, but shouldn’t we give him a chance to respond? I’m not canceling him off of my newsletter or podcast list yet. He has always come off as arrogant and a bit of a narcissist, but in my opinion, that has nothing to do with the quality of the interviews or articles he provides, which I have found to be good overall. Some of the most competent physicians are arrogant narcissists, but that doesn’t mean they don’t provide valuable information. I am not a paying member of anything he provides, which may have required a different plan if it were the case, so for now I will let the hot takes moments pass and see how this all plays out.
Good points Michelle. And look, your more measured response took longer than quick 1 liners. I've taken care of murderers, drug dealers and even politicians. Sure, I feel icky afterwards but it certainly doesn't mean I approve of their activities--even if they "paid a price to society." Should conviction or jail time change the miasma around all these judgments? The moral train, if you choose to get on it, still stops at every station. Has Alex never known anyone who committed adultery in his circle of "friends". Still talk to them? How about cheating on taxes ("I'll expense account it"). I cannot even count what remaining in NY means if your kid had a cardiac arrest in LA (really, a cardiac arrest? pretty unusual in itself. Whole story?) I cannot even pretend to know what he and his wife decided about that. I did a renal consult in the morning on a patient in the hospital my wife delivered in a few hours later. Anyone can come up with 20 scenarios around this fact--time to lose my license to practice medicine?
The email is dated 2016, eight years after Epstein publicly plead guilty to trafficking children.
Attia would be suspect at best by association if the email was strictly professional.
Sending that email to his pedophile buddy means he needs to have his hard drive checked!
I have noticed that a lot of Jewish writers and editors decided years ago that there was no conspiracy, so Bari won't do anything to him or to her "wife" that spiked the Epstein story for the NYT. That's fine. At least these emails give the public some insights into our public figures.
He did not plead guilty in 2008 to "trafficking children." He plead to "procuring a person under 18 for prostitution" and "soliciting a prostitute". But I agree, anyone who would associate with someone who solicits sex from minors has questionable character themselves.
I’m not a man but I agree. I’ve had a lot of men friends and been privy to some things I wouldn’t have expected. But even I know that what I’ve heard is not the same as when men are alone with each other.
Thank you, Elizabeth. I've watched the comments roll in, and I think you might be the only female commenter who acknowledged something my mother told me in the 1980's after I'd become a man, when she said, "Girls grow up, boys just get taller." To the male commenters pretending to be angels, I'd be willing to bet my pet unicorn that they're not. :)
Everyone is abuzz about all the titillating details related to this Epstein mess. People are focused on the pedophilia, upper crust buddy clubbing and rancid sophomoric behavior exhibited by people who should know better. Personally I really don’t care, I stopped reading Sidney Sheldon novels when I turned 21. What I DO care about is the “influence peddling” and political manipulation occurring at the International level. Who did what for who? And who got what for what? That’s the important premise as this goes on and there has been little focus on it so far. The Media and the political hacks that we have elected are very happy not to take a deep dive and blow up this House of Cards. Just keep showing us that 3 Card Monty and hope everyone is too stupid not to care about what really matters
Since the file release I have posted many times — and now on this thread (above) — that if you haven’t bothered to read One Nation Under Blackmail you really shouldn’t be opining on Epstein. The other thing that irks me is when people have probably drawn from Webb’s research but don’t give her the credit.
I have seen a few brief interviews with the author and should dive deeper, thanks. Having Roy Cohn on the cover is brilliant…truly the Scummiest of Bags!
@Ivan- not necessarily. I have two good women friends who are married and are probably more conservative than I am. But I agree that Weiss is not conservative.
We now see who Peter Attia really is. He makes my skin scrawl. Who could ever look or listen to him again and take anything he says with dignity or seriousness? He's now a huge stain and liability for anyone who engages him. Good riddance.
I’m sorry, Peter Attia is in my Apple Podcast catalogue and there he will stay. I may even move up a couple of his discussions just to spite the haters.
At first /- a few years back -/ I thought he was okay but then I listened to some critiques of his medical advice from others in the wellness “space” and decided he was sort of full of himself, tbh. So what has been further revealed rather fits the picture I already had of him.
Attia, Dr. Attia, is more than a "headline reader."
Not sure I’d say Bari quit because her conservative views put her at odds with the rest of the NYT staff - more like she wasn’t as fully leftist looney as the NYT staff AND that she still had some journalistic integrity.
This Epstein fiasco is getting too much. One, even total scumbags, evil doers like Epstein have acceptable interactions with acceptable people. Case in point, Montana Museum of the Rockies idol, Jack Horner of dinosaur fame, was in the news last night because he was involved with Epstein: Epstein has, 🤔 HAD a ranch in New Mexico that he granted access to Horner et al for study/digs - appreciative correspondence was exchanged.
As for slinging arrows at all who had interactions with Epstein over the years, I’m not sure his nefarious actions WERE all that well known, at least by those that privy to inside info. He had been protected by political interests, for what ever intents and I assert if it weren’t for deviant Democrat dawgs and the colleagues of our our dear Alex whose only interest in the "Epstein files" is to find any connection to POTUS Trump. But for those early tertiary contacts, two wealthy men in NYC 🙄, there would be little interest in Epstein. Remember, pre-POTUS Trump famously kicked Epstein’s ass to the curb when he got wind of Epstein’s peccadillos.
I think the relationship between Epstein and MS Gates of far more interest than much of the other interactions.
The question I keep hearing over&over is where did Epstein’s wealth come from?
Yes! I am hoping Alex’s big story has to do with the pandemic bonds and funds that JPMorgan people, Gates, Epstein and others were putting together to get rich off when a pandemic was declared etc. Makes me sick. Sayer Ji wrote a fantastic article outlining the timeline of the creation of these funds starting in 2011, I believe. I highly recommend that article, available to all on Green Med Info.
Read One Nation Under Blackmail which traces his rise and extensively documents his relationship to Leslie Wexner (retail magnate with loads of shady activities) If you don’t have time for set down with 2 volumes of investigative journalism, the author, Whitney Webb, has plenty of interviews that she’s given about Epstein that can be found on YouTube.
Check out the Eric Weinstein interview about his encounter with Epstein in a business context (it's on YouTube, I forget whether it was Joe Rogan or another podcast). He was 100% convinced Epstein was not a financial whiz kid who could have made all that money himself.
I listened to Weinstein and I agree with him. Epstein had seed money from some unnamed source. Had to be. He didn't even have the insider info Nancy Pelosi used, so....
I really am tired of the whole thing and am at the "who cares" point. Some folks have been "caught" but many have not been and won't be. Let's move on to substantive issues and stop the tut tut ting.
Wow, well, let's just drop it because you're tired of it. Do you not understand that this case represents everything that is wrong with our country and world now? Those with extraordinary influence receive extraordinary protection when they bend and break the law - protections that any one of us on these comments would never receive. And the most vulnerable among us (children, young women, etc.) are simply used as chattel and tossed aside, left to pick up the pieces of their lives. But let's stop worrying about it because a few people like you are bored with it? Please elaborate on these substantive issues that you find so much more interesting.
all this PR isn't changing anything or doing anything to protect the vulnerable - it only feeds the salacious, gossipy curiosity of folks. What we need to do is focus on the efforts to stop sex trafficking, especially around events such as the Super Bowl and World Cup. The sexualization of young girls - children even - is everywhere in our culture - eye makeup for 10 year olds? That's just one example so there are plenty of constructive things to do to fight exploitation that aren't nearly as salacious as carrying on about the Epstein files.
The salacious details are relevant in court, but I understand that they tend to feed public curiosity. I am angry and disgusted by the sex trafficking that continues unabated in this country and am well aware of its presence at events such as the Super Bowl. Certainly efforts to arrest and convict perpetrators should be elevated, but what better way to send a strong message than to put, for example, Bill Gates in prison for life, if he indeed is guilty? I believe that more than wanting to read about sordid details, most people want to know that if Bill Clinton, Prince Andrew, Ehud Barak, or any random billionaire participated in the rape and molestation of underage girls that they would be punished to the fullest extent of the law. The fact that none of them ever will be is catastrophic to a civil society.
@Kristen- ^^THIS. Hence my comment above (or below, I guess). It may not be front page news anymore-good- but I'm sincerely hoping they're still going after the vile, evil scum that is still out there roaming around.
Those of you who are running to Peter Attia's defense seemed to be forgetting one thing... Jeffrey Epstein was a known pedophile. So his obscene talk shouldn't be written off as locker room talk, unless locker room talk is rife with pedophilia.
99% of America does not care. I live in the South and even here you would be hard pressed to find someone that cares about Epstein outside of a vague reference point for elite malfeasance or a source of amusing pop culture slop. It's always fun to see the mighty stumble. Hardly anyone believes Epstein was really an Illuminati Mossad Double Secret Grand Wizard that enslaved scores of underage girls for the benefit of powerful men and then tossed them in the wood chipper after a late night on the beach. The media feed that narrative with the help of a tiny but vocal cohort of the mentally ill.
What we're talking about here is rich, bored, older men that partied with adult hookers at a beach resort. Shitbags? Sure. Some corruption/blackmail mixed in? Probably. Lucifer himself ? Probably not.
He certainly did. And I'm sure you've read the court documents where police and prosecutors admit there is no evidence he targeted underage girls and no evidence he was aware any of the girls were minors. You also know that multiple women refused to cooperate with police and went on record that they were not "trafficked", held against their will, or forced to engage in any acts. No one claimed violence or murder.
Undoubtedly, you're aware that many of the women suing banks, governments, and estates for billions of dollars have completely changed their stories despite previously telling police and FBI multiple times that there's nothing to see. Funny how that happens once money starts to rain down. Some have admitted their claims of "trafficking" and "abuse" occurred while adults. Some don't even claim real sexual acts but instead argue that things like hand-holding were "illegal sexual activity". Multiple women brought to testify by the prosecution during Ghislaine's trial were rebuked by the court and jurors were told their language and claims were unfounded.
And the cherry on top? Haley Robson, an alleged adult "victim" demanding millions of dollars, was a local madam that wrangled wayward teens and brought them to Epstein specifically telling them to say they're at least 18. And she did it all in exchange for cash. The police have wiretaps with her admitting to this behavior. That is actual intentional trafficking of minors and a warrant was issued for her arrest as a result.
We also need to understand the legal concept of "strict liability" whereby you're guilty of certain crimes regardless of your intentions or the circumstances surrounding your transgression (including lying, cheating, lack of knowledge etc). This is common with sexual crimes that involve minors. And even so, the files from his case show that police and prosecutors were concerned about their ability to obtain a conviction because of a lack of evidence that he actively tried to acquire underage girls and a long line of women that admitted to simply being adult prostitutes.
Epstein was a slimy guy up to no good. He absolutely should've been held accountable. He engaged in dangerous careless behavior that ensnared minors (knowingly or otherwise) and that's not acceptable. As for his friends -- yes there was obviously some element of corruption/blackmail/access-buying. But the evidence tells us he was not kidnapping 7 yr olds and holding rape/murder parties in furtherance of some shadowy Mossad black op.
In reality, most of the sexual activity was described as "sexualized massage" with adult women. Not exactly a Bacchanalia. Sounds like a bunch of old dudes getting handies from local strippers/escorts.
poor guy accidentally employing underage hookers - i hate it when people trick me into that!
at least bill gates, the clintons, prince andrew, and peter attia were so understanding and definitely didn't visit him for the thing he was famous for.
I do wish the victims would sue those that they claim did commit crimes such as rape, sex while they were under age and stop playing victim, although I wonder if they fear for their life if they finally come forth. I 110% agree that once money became the end result, everyone tried to play victim. This is such a travesty for the real victims.
"Character is often defined by how a person treats those who are in a lower social position or who cannot offer any benefit in return. It reflects true kindness and respect, showing empathy and humility towards everyone, regardless of their status."
Seems closely related to how you conduct yourself when you think no one will .ever know.
Man, what a bummer. I read Attia's book on longevity and listen to him occasionally. We men really are pigs and I'd be embarrassed if my text threads to my close friends ever became public, but as far as I know none of my friends are convicted pedos.
Men and women IF honest have said things about the opposite SEX or same sex thru the eons of time. The ONE diff here is this is a Doctor talking to a patient so it is what it IS in crossing a boundary
Yes for some reason the link would not be allowed to be watched on this site...not sure why. Was a Benny Johnson video on youtube where he showed emails between those like Epstein, Gates, Fauci and others showing just how PLANned the 2020 plandemic was. From this most recent release of Epstein docs!
The New York Times is a "news organization"? Alex, you misspelled "hard left, progressive lapdog".
If there was a Nobel Prize for putting out fake news, the New York Times would get it every year.
Because I believe Mr Berenson still wants to return to the NY Slimes, but waiting for the right moment to minimize outrage/ accusations of sell out.
Also, the comments about Attia reflect the basic truism: deeds not words are what define us.
Wow, a post about Epstein, quite the challenge there, eh, Mr B?…
"Fake left, deep state lapdog".
Boy, you live in an hermitically sealed intellectual world.
Judge by actions, not words. Attia, Gates, Hoffman, and Summers are permanently stained. Any organization that chooses to associate with them the way they chose to associate with Epstein will suffer reputational damage.
I do hope you are right, however, many have short memories. The next boogey man may make their actions be long forgotten. I also think their money will lead the way for them to quickly return to business favor.
Why do they care?
How many men who read this Substack have stupid locker room texts and emails in their past? Yeah, that's what I thought, every single one of us. It's what boys and men do with each other in private. We make obscene jokes that we would never dare outside of "man talk". It's not fair to judge Attia by one tidbit of an email string that I'm sure had a long precursor and tail. It's not even "terrible judgment", it's actually called privacy...distasteful privacy? Sure. Beyond that, everything is fiction.
I agree. People who happened to be in " New York Society" who were photographed at a party with Epstein are now being scorned. Any one of us who might have gone to a soiree and pictured is presumed to be a pedophile. This is insanity. I personally don't care about the hoi polloi who were there. If a man sucked up to wealth over his child, it is between him and his wife. Now his son has a history of his father being a dope forever. I am appalled by the interest in every person's dailliances. We have people being murdered in Iran, Nigeria, Sudan and not a peep from mainstream press. Our priorities are screwed up.
I don't. I have said stupid things in a locker room environment in the past, but I was never stupid enough to put them in an email or a text.
That said, I don't think the emails alone are the problem. Nor is Alex saying so. He's saying Attia's *behavior* was the problem: specifically, prioritizing meeting with a scumbag in New York over being with his wife and son when his son had a cardiac arrest. That's reprehensible *behavior*, not locker room talk.
That’s only so if the assertion regarding his sin is correct. Strikes me his wife would divorce for that. If she hasn’t perhaps the story isn’t completely accurate.
He said in his own 2017 book that he stayed in New York for ten days after learning that his son in LA had a cardiac arrest. That's already questionable, but okay, maybe he had a really, really good reason. But the Epstein emails reveal that no, his reason was to meet with Epstein. That's not a good reason at all, let alone a really, really good reason.
Note that the claim is *not* that Attia had sex with underage girls or participated in any of Epstein's schemes along those lines (which I take it is why you used the word "sin"). It's just that, as I said, he prioritized meeting with a scumbag over being with his wife and son (*infant* son) when his son had a cardiac arrest. Perhaps that's not a "sin", but it certainly seems to me like reprehensible behavior.
sorry I have spent 68 years adoring the females and I have not a single text or email that stoops into the gutter like these scum bags.
@Mike- I'm a woman and have said the same thing about locker room talk. As if women don't do it. Please...However, a dr responding to a patient? Uncalled for.
Exactly. Attia is suspect at best but the focus on his pussy jokes is absurd.
I completely agree if that is all the emails reveal, John and Mike. I haven’t read a good and thorough synopsis of them yet. Alex’s is the best so far, and he doesn’t really give us much detail when there are over 1700 communications. More information and context is needed. Was he Epstein’s physician? If so, as healthcare providers know, all of your patients are not Mother Theresa. We do however always have the right to dismiss a patient whose philosophy does not mesh with our own.
For his colleagues who are posting negative things about him because of this, I hope they’ve contacted him directly and had a conversation, and I commented as much on Dr. Sara Gottfried Szal’s post. Otherwise, this is cancel culture imho. I recommend people let the hot takes time period pass without a rush to judgment.
Yes, the email was crude and juvenile, and his continued association with a convicted sex offender is suspect and doesn’t say a lot of great things about his character, but shouldn’t we give him a chance to respond? I’m not canceling him off of my newsletter or podcast list yet. He has always come off as arrogant and a bit of a narcissist, but in my opinion, that has nothing to do with the quality of the interviews or articles he provides, which I have found to be good overall. Some of the most competent physicians are arrogant narcissists, but that doesn’t mean they don’t provide valuable information. I am not a paying member of anything he provides, which may have required a different plan if it were the case, so for now I will let the hot takes moments pass and see how this all plays out.
Good points Michelle. And look, your more measured response took longer than quick 1 liners. I've taken care of murderers, drug dealers and even politicians. Sure, I feel icky afterwards but it certainly doesn't mean I approve of their activities--even if they "paid a price to society." Should conviction or jail time change the miasma around all these judgments? The moral train, if you choose to get on it, still stops at every station. Has Alex never known anyone who committed adultery in his circle of "friends". Still talk to them? How about cheating on taxes ("I'll expense account it"). I cannot even count what remaining in NY means if your kid had a cardiac arrest in LA (really, a cardiac arrest? pretty unusual in itself. Whole story?) I cannot even pretend to know what he and his wife decided about that. I did a renal consult in the morning on a patient in the hospital my wife delivered in a few hours later. Anyone can come up with 20 scenarios around this fact--time to lose my license to practice medicine?
Thank you, cjmd. I appreciate your thoughtful response.
The email is dated 2016, eight years after Epstein publicly plead guilty to trafficking children.
Attia would be suspect at best by association if the email was strictly professional.
Sending that email to his pedophile buddy means he needs to have his hard drive checked!
I have noticed that a lot of Jewish writers and editors decided years ago that there was no conspiracy, so Bari won't do anything to him or to her "wife" that spiked the Epstein story for the NYT. That's fine. At least these emails give the public some insights into our public figures.
Hopefully there are more to come!
He did not plead guilty in 2008 to "trafficking children." He plead to "procuring a person under 18 for prostitution" and "soliciting a prostitute". But I agree, anyone who would associate with someone who solicits sex from minors has questionable character themselves.
I don't have written stupid locker rm texts. Kind of a thing with me to avoid that type of conversations.
How many men who read this Substack have stupid locker room texts and emails in their past to and from convicted pedophiles?
I’m not a man but I agree. I’ve had a lot of men friends and been privy to some things I wouldn’t have expected. But even I know that what I’ve heard is not the same as when men are alone with each other.
Thank you, Elizabeth. I've watched the comments roll in, and I think you might be the only female commenter who acknowledged something my mother told me in the 1980's after I'd become a man, when she said, "Girls grow up, boys just get taller." To the male commenters pretending to be angels, I'd be willing to bet my pet unicorn that they're not. :)
Everyone is abuzz about all the titillating details related to this Epstein mess. People are focused on the pedophilia, upper crust buddy clubbing and rancid sophomoric behavior exhibited by people who should know better. Personally I really don’t care, I stopped reading Sidney Sheldon novels when I turned 21. What I DO care about is the “influence peddling” and political manipulation occurring at the International level. Who did what for who? And who got what for what? That’s the important premise as this goes on and there has been little focus on it so far. The Media and the political hacks that we have elected are very happy not to take a deep dive and blow up this House of Cards. Just keep showing us that 3 Card Monty and hope everyone is too stupid not to care about what really matters
Yes; the messy sleaze is not the full story.
This book provides a great deal more about how the Epstein activities fit into a larger narrative. Good solid investigative journalism.
https://a.co/d/07kxduI1
Since the file release I have posted many times — and now on this thread (above) — that if you haven’t bothered to read One Nation Under Blackmail you really shouldn’t be opining on Epstein. The other thing that irks me is when people have probably drawn from Webb’s research but don’t give her the credit.
I have seen a few brief interviews with the author and should dive deeper, thanks. Having Roy Cohn on the cover is brilliant…truly the Scummiest of Bags!
YES! This is the Real Story IMO.
👏🏻
I am pretty positive that Bari Weiss does not have conservative views. Two women marrying each other seems to dispel that viewpoint.
@Ivan- not necessarily. I have two good women friends who are married and are probably more conservative than I am. But I agree that Weiss is not conservative.
Look at Scott Bessent and Guy Benson. Can argue on perhaps religious grounds, but not really on a political affliation like Conservative or not
I came here to also comment that Bari Weiss is no conservative. And for more reasons than her relationship with a woman.
We now see who Peter Attia really is. He makes my skin scrawl. Who could ever look or listen to him again and take anything he says with dignity or seriousness? He's now a huge stain and liability for anyone who engages him. Good riddance.
I’m sorry, Peter Attia is in my Apple Podcast catalogue and there he will stay. I may even move up a couple of his discussions just to spite the haters.
enjoy life without a conscience
Ahh, there it is 😊 I knew at least one hater would show up.
For the record, it’s my conscience that keeps me on the straight&narrow (not condemning with insufficient info).
Not only that, tonight I’ll be sleeping snug as a bug, curled up with my conscience.
Cheers
At first /- a few years back -/ I thought he was okay but then I listened to some critiques of his medical advice from others in the wellness “space” and decided he was sort of full of himself, tbh. So what has been further revealed rather fits the picture I already had of him.
Because he met with Epstein? Or is this parody? Good job if it is.
Attia, Dr. Attia, is more than a "headline reader."
Not sure I’d say Bari quit because her conservative views put her at odds with the rest of the NYT staff - more like she wasn’t as fully leftist looney as the NYT staff AND that she still had some journalistic integrity.
This Epstein fiasco is getting too much. One, even total scumbags, evil doers like Epstein have acceptable interactions with acceptable people. Case in point, Montana Museum of the Rockies idol, Jack Horner of dinosaur fame, was in the news last night because he was involved with Epstein: Epstein has, 🤔 HAD a ranch in New Mexico that he granted access to Horner et al for study/digs - appreciative correspondence was exchanged.
As for slinging arrows at all who had interactions with Epstein over the years, I’m not sure his nefarious actions WERE all that well known, at least by those that privy to inside info. He had been protected by political interests, for what ever intents and I assert if it weren’t for deviant Democrat dawgs and the colleagues of our our dear Alex whose only interest in the "Epstein files" is to find any connection to POTUS Trump. But for those early tertiary contacts, two wealthy men in NYC 🙄, there would be little interest in Epstein. Remember, pre-POTUS Trump famously kicked Epstein’s ass to the curb when he got wind of Epstein’s peccadillos.
I think the relationship between Epstein and MS Gates of far more interest than much of the other interactions.
The question I keep hearing over&over is where did Epstein’s wealth come from?
Yes! I am hoping Alex’s big story has to do with the pandemic bonds and funds that JPMorgan people, Gates, Epstein and others were putting together to get rich off when a pandemic was declared etc. Makes me sick. Sayer Ji wrote a fantastic article outlining the timeline of the creation of these funds starting in 2011, I believe. I highly recommend that article, available to all on Green Med Info.
Read One Nation Under Blackmail which traces his rise and extensively documents his relationship to Leslie Wexner (retail magnate with loads of shady activities) If you don’t have time for set down with 2 volumes of investigative journalism, the author, Whitney Webb, has plenty of interviews that she’s given about Epstein that can be found on YouTube.
No one has ever explained just how Epstein got so rich. That’s what I want to know.
Listen to the Joe Rogan podcast with Mike Benz this week.
Check out the Eric Weinstein interview about his encounter with Epstein in a business context (it's on YouTube, I forget whether it was Joe Rogan or another podcast). He was 100% convinced Epstein was not a financial whiz kid who could have made all that money himself.
I listened to Weinstein and I agree with him. Epstein had seed money from some unnamed source. Had to be. He didn't even have the insider info Nancy Pelosi used, so....
Ditto.
To me that's a more interesting question the other more lurid questions about him.
Working for a foreign government?
Multiple
One Nation Under Blackmail, by Whitney Webb or look up her many interviews on various YouTube channels.
I really am tired of the whole thing and am at the "who cares" point. Some folks have been "caught" but many have not been and won't be. Let's move on to substantive issues and stop the tut tut ting.
Wow, well, let's just drop it because you're tired of it. Do you not understand that this case represents everything that is wrong with our country and world now? Those with extraordinary influence receive extraordinary protection when they bend and break the law - protections that any one of us on these comments would never receive. And the most vulnerable among us (children, young women, etc.) are simply used as chattel and tossed aside, left to pick up the pieces of their lives. But let's stop worrying about it because a few people like you are bored with it? Please elaborate on these substantive issues that you find so much more interesting.
all this PR isn't changing anything or doing anything to protect the vulnerable - it only feeds the salacious, gossipy curiosity of folks. What we need to do is focus on the efforts to stop sex trafficking, especially around events such as the Super Bowl and World Cup. The sexualization of young girls - children even - is everywhere in our culture - eye makeup for 10 year olds? That's just one example so there are plenty of constructive things to do to fight exploitation that aren't nearly as salacious as carrying on about the Epstein files.
The salacious details are relevant in court, but I understand that they tend to feed public curiosity. I am angry and disgusted by the sex trafficking that continues unabated in this country and am well aware of its presence at events such as the Super Bowl. Certainly efforts to arrest and convict perpetrators should be elevated, but what better way to send a strong message than to put, for example, Bill Gates in prison for life, if he indeed is guilty? I believe that more than wanting to read about sordid details, most people want to know that if Bill Clinton, Prince Andrew, Ehud Barak, or any random billionaire participated in the rape and molestation of underage girls that they would be punished to the fullest extent of the law. The fact that none of them ever will be is catastrophic to a civil society.
@Kristen- ^^THIS. Hence my comment above (or below, I guess). It may not be front page news anymore-good- but I'm sincerely hoping they're still going after the vile, evil scum that is still out there roaming around.
I'm with you. Tyrus said the same thing on Gutfeld last night.
Love Tyrus! He calls it like he sees it! Lots of wisdom coming from him.
Those of you who are running to Peter Attia's defense seemed to be forgetting one thing... Jeffrey Epstein was a known pedophile. So his obscene talk shouldn't be written off as locker room talk, unless locker room talk is rife with pedophilia.
Yeah, it's "elementary school locker rooms" they're talking about.
Problem is….I believe Congress only released FBI and DOJ files.
What’s in the CIA files?
@Miriam- Ooo....Good call.
👏🏻 👏🏻 👏🏻
99% of America does not care. I live in the South and even here you would be hard pressed to find someone that cares about Epstein outside of a vague reference point for elite malfeasance or a source of amusing pop culture slop. It's always fun to see the mighty stumble. Hardly anyone believes Epstein was really an Illuminati Mossad Double Secret Grand Wizard that enslaved scores of underage girls for the benefit of powerful men and then tossed them in the wood chipper after a late night on the beach. The media feed that narrative with the help of a tiny but vocal cohort of the mentally ill.
What we're talking about here is rich, bored, older men that partied with adult hookers at a beach resort. Shitbags? Sure. Some corruption/blackmail mixed in? Probably. Lucifer himself ? Probably not.
You do know he plead guilty in 2008 to trafficking underage children, right?
Anybody associating with him afterwards was not looking for "adult hookers".
He certainly did. And I'm sure you've read the court documents where police and prosecutors admit there is no evidence he targeted underage girls and no evidence he was aware any of the girls were minors. You also know that multiple women refused to cooperate with police and went on record that they were not "trafficked", held against their will, or forced to engage in any acts. No one claimed violence or murder.
Undoubtedly, you're aware that many of the women suing banks, governments, and estates for billions of dollars have completely changed their stories despite previously telling police and FBI multiple times that there's nothing to see. Funny how that happens once money starts to rain down. Some have admitted their claims of "trafficking" and "abuse" occurred while adults. Some don't even claim real sexual acts but instead argue that things like hand-holding were "illegal sexual activity". Multiple women brought to testify by the prosecution during Ghislaine's trial were rebuked by the court and jurors were told their language and claims were unfounded.
And the cherry on top? Haley Robson, an alleged adult "victim" demanding millions of dollars, was a local madam that wrangled wayward teens and brought them to Epstein specifically telling them to say they're at least 18. And she did it all in exchange for cash. The police have wiretaps with her admitting to this behavior. That is actual intentional trafficking of minors and a warrant was issued for her arrest as a result.
We also need to understand the legal concept of "strict liability" whereby you're guilty of certain crimes regardless of your intentions or the circumstances surrounding your transgression (including lying, cheating, lack of knowledge etc). This is common with sexual crimes that involve minors. And even so, the files from his case show that police and prosecutors were concerned about their ability to obtain a conviction because of a lack of evidence that he actively tried to acquire underage girls and a long line of women that admitted to simply being adult prostitutes.
Epstein was a slimy guy up to no good. He absolutely should've been held accountable. He engaged in dangerous careless behavior that ensnared minors (knowingly or otherwise) and that's not acceptable. As for his friends -- yes there was obviously some element of corruption/blackmail/access-buying. But the evidence tells us he was not kidnapping 7 yr olds and holding rape/murder parties in furtherance of some shadowy Mossad black op.
In reality, most of the sexual activity was described as "sexualized massage" with adult women. Not exactly a Bacchanalia. Sounds like a bunch of old dudes getting handies from local strippers/escorts.
poor guy accidentally employing underage hookers - i hate it when people trick me into that!
at least bill gates, the clintons, prince andrew, and peter attia were so understanding and definitely didn't visit him for the thing he was famous for.
I do wish the victims would sue those that they claim did commit crimes such as rape, sex while they were under age and stop playing victim, although I wonder if they fear for their life if they finally come forth. I 110% agree that once money became the end result, everyone tried to play victim. This is such a travesty for the real victims.
"Character is often defined by how a person treats those who are in a lower social position or who cannot offer any benefit in return. It reflects true kindness and respect, showing empathy and humility towards everyone, regardless of their status."
Seems closely related to how you conduct yourself when you think no one will .ever know.
Democrats need to place the release in the “be careful what you ask for” file
nancy pelosi's daughter famously said "it's quite likely that some our faves are implicated"
https://www.foxnews.com/politics/christine-pelosi-jeffrey-epstein-democrats-faves-implicated
Man, what a bummer. I read Attia's book on longevity and listen to him occasionally. We men really are pigs and I'd be embarrassed if my text threads to my close friends ever became public, but as far as I know none of my friends are convicted pedos.
Men and women IF honest have said things about the opposite SEX or same sex thru the eons of time. The ONE diff here is this is a Doctor talking to a patient so it is what it IS in crossing a boundary
Hello Brogan 12. You replied to a comment I made with a link to a video. Unfortunately when I try to watch it it is unavailable.
Yes for some reason the link would not be allowed to be watched on this site...not sure why. Was a Benny Johnson video on youtube where he showed emails between those like Epstein, Gates, Fauci and others showing just how PLANned the 2020 plandemic was. From this most recent release of Epstein docs!
Got it! Thanks
Hat tip to George Carlin, “It’s a big club and be glad you ain’t in it”.
Oh yeah, the only arrests and prosecutions were a couple of busted-out, wanker sleazoid Brits.